Categorising music albums

Monday, February 27, 2006

I've had heaps of albums on my PC for a few years now, but since I got the iRiver, access to albums had to be made faster. Without an iPooed wheel that quickly scans down lists, I devised a makeshift folder system to divide up the files, figuring that I could classify my albums into about six categories. While it's worked well, the sheer volume and variety of albums has crowded up the lists and now it's not so organised after all. Including podcasts, standalone tracks and a few other files, my iRiver is currently hosting 644 folders with 5851 songs.

On the original pH-style "PH" scale (named after yours truly), the genres are:

  • 1 Light
  • 2 Pop Rock
  • 3 Rock & Roll
  • 4 Rock
  • 5 Heavy Rock
  • 6 Metal

Light is softer rock, with more ambient/creative stuff such as Evermore, Travis or Pete Murray. Critics could say the "You know how I know you're gay? You listen to Coldplay/insert band from Light" a la The 40 Year Old Virgin principle could also be in place here.
Pop Rock is Indie like The Killers or Franz Ferdinand and Australian quirky but rockin bands like Eskimo Joe or Little Birdy.
Rock & Roll is traditional guitar-solo-ripping 60s/70s influenced stuff like Oasis, Wolfmother or Jet or even 50s/blues influenced stuff like The Hives or The White Stripes.
Rock is the umbrella term for rocking guitar/bass/drums stuff like Foo Fighters, Red Hot Chili Peppers or Smashing Pumpkins.
Heavy Rock has more metal/nu-metal edges, stuff they play at Switch like Papa Roach, Linkin Park or Evanescence.
Metal is another umbrella term, spanning System of a Down, Nightwish, Sevendust, Metallica, Dream Theater and beyond.

It's awesome because if you recognise, say, three bands in one folder that you like, the others are probably going to hit a few right notes for you too. Depending on the broadness of your taste, you'll probably enjoy albums either side of your favourite genre too. When I don't know what to listen to, I can also work out what mood I'm in from 1 to 6 to narrow down what I'm going to put on.

I had to add "Comedy", "Punk", "Soundtracks" and "Other". "Soundtracks" in theory could be split up, but I'd need a Pop or Novelty folder for that (which I'll probably do). The "Other" folder started because I can't classify Radiohead (suggestions welcome!), then continued because I felt Jamiroquai and Massive Attack were too electrish and has now become the "To Be Sorted" folder as well. Pop Rock also became so big I chucked it into A-K and L-Z phonebook-style. The realistic divide there is Indie and Aussie Pop Rock bands (for some reason Indie's all overseas bands, must be a cultural thing). Metal needs a fair bit o' work too, like a nu-metal folder for one, but thankfully there's no shortage of friends willing to discuss the finer genres of metal!

Ideally, all genre folders should have no more than 16 artists inside, because the iRiver display shows 8 at a time (and I can scan from top or bottom). That's a bit of extra categorising, but not impossible. Secondly, it's gotta continue making it logical for people to know which of my music they should thieve.

Another problem is how to insert dance/techno/electro/whatever music in there. I'll probably expand the left (Light) edge to pop then dance, then techno...but anything without traditional band instruments is really tough for me to classify, even in a consistent way to myself! At least I can deal with more punk/heavy rock distinction.

Clearly it's still very early stages, but having typed it out it seems a bit closer to reality. I've still got a few dozen albums I'd like to go through and see if there are categories I'm not thinking of first, but by the end it should be an easy way to recommend albums to people by gauging their preferred genres to start with and expanding outwards. From there, I wouldn't mind creating/using a database for the Internet at large to check albums in the collection (not just ones I've bought) along with the genre, date it was added and the source (i.e. recommender) and stuff like that. Can any readers out there recommend something like that?

Has anyone out there seen or devised their own genre classifying organisation system? Particularly ones using similar sliding scales or multi-dimensional plots (like the Political Compass)? Does anyone have a program to help list out my current albums based on directory structure too?

The Punk Experiment

Thursday, February 23, 2006

In the old Switch days (2004 I guess), punk always stayed in the no-go zone on the bottom floor and we stayed up top on the metal floor. Any punk songs played upstairs would draw the ire of some of our group. Back then I think Brodie and Crag were very strict in their music tastes and since, they've really loosened up. In Crag's case, probably for the worst. Several different sources have come together in the past week or so and the time is right to give punk (or as Crag would say "punk metal") some airplay on Radio Pat.

After missing Trial Kennedy and realising I hadn't listened to enough Karnivool to need to see them either, I decided to go back and listen to the tunes I stole off Brodie's PC months ago. I'd been delaying it as I had other music and a bunch of podcasts to catch up to. I liked quite a bit of the stuff: Story of the Year and Trial Kennedy in particular.

One week before that, I'd been listening to a bunch of random songs of Will's and among other songs, Motion City Soundtrack's The Future Freaks Me Out got my attention. I went on LimeWire later and downloaded the next highest song on the list, My Favourite Accident, which is even more awesome. Turns out it was on the Burnout 3: Takedown video game soundtrack that I'd played and loved a year or so ago. I went back to Burnout 3 yesterday and did some sleuthing for more punk leads to download. A lot of recently big names in punk/emo that I recognised were there: My Chemical Romance, The Used, Yellowcard, Funeral For A Friend and New Found Glory among them so it looks like a solid base.

I remember checking out a couple of punk songs on the advice of Dan from Pizza Den back when we both worked there, as he was always pumping it up. Apart from that, I haven't really discussed it much. I can't be the only one who's interested in expanding their musical knowledge a little. Plus there could be some interesting bass riffs.

There's no definitive conclusion to the experiment just yet and it's safe to say there'll be hits and misses no matter what I listen to. My main criticisms of punk were that the songs sounded like one another after a few tracks into the album (which I'm addressing by taking it a track at a time) and the singers were generally too whiny for my liking (which is more of an emo thing I guess anyway). Both of these took a little adjustment, but I found that a lot of punk bands are close to metal (or nu-metal) and others are poppy like a quirky indie band, so there is common ground that I can relate to. I guess a few bands I already listened to like Lostprophets, Jimmy Eat World or Gyroscope could be loosely lumped into the new yellow punk/emo section of JB too, so maybe I wasn't so far away after all.

Sorry if you're bored with music and sport, feel free to request a discussion topic if you're interested in my two cents on something a little more varied.

Maroondah Festival

Monday, February 20, 2006

I may have awarded the Sun a rare victory in our ongoing saga, but that didn't put a damper on the festivities at Sunday's Maroondah Festival at Croydon Park.

While I should have travelled down earlier to catch more than a song of Trial Kennedy's set, Kisschasy were quite good despite their askew attempts at crowd control. Behind Crimson Eyes also provided good entertainment to the black clothed teen punk brigade too. It's encouraging to see the organisers securing another decent (and free) lineup after bringing Spiderbait last year and Bodyjar (once rumoured to actually be called Croydon such is their love affair with EVs and the suburb) the year before.

I really like the idea of live music "in my backyard", alongside a bunch of other stuff going on that you can check out between acts (although we never did go to the kids stage and throw up the horns \m/). It effectively creates a hub of interest in Croydon, which isn't normally the case. I never really had any Croydon pride until I met the Ringwood crowd in high school, when I felt obliged to defend my homeland. Back in those days we had the cinema and they had the ice rink instead. How times change. Still, Croydon knows how to throw a festival when we want to, and we've got more parks and space to host it than anywhere else in the Maroondah district.

So woo for Croydon and woo for entertainment that I could walk to if I wanted to (and if I wasn't running late).

Olympic Hockey Predictions

Tuesday, February 14, 2006

Canada's the runaway favourite for the Olympics in ice hockey, and with such incredible depth I can't see anyone beating the defending champs along their path to golden glory. Their goaltenders Martin Brodeur, Roberto Luongo and Marty Turco are the best in the world and they could churn out goals from any of their four lines. Stars like Jarome Iginla, Dany Heatley, Joe Sakic and Martin St. Louis line the covers of hockey video games everywhere. They are a team of genuine All-Stars.

Among the challengers, I expect the Swedes to win silver and the Russians to take bronze with Finland fourth. Sweden look a little thin without Markus Naslund (and possibly Peter Forsberg too), but with solid defence and a stack o' goals from Daniel Alfredsson, I think they can win through if netminder Henrik Lundqvist runs hot. The Russians have potent scorers in Ilya Kovalchuk, Pavel Datsyuk and Alex Ovechkin, but look shaky elsewhere. Regular goaltender Nikolai Khabibulin's withdrawal gives Evgeni Nabokov a chance between the pipes and I feel he might make something of it. I'm picking an outsider in Finland to cause an upset and reach the semis. Had Miikka Kiprusoff not withdrawn, I would have predicted a medal. With personal favourites Olli Jokinen, Jere Lehtinen and Joni Pitkanen, I think they'll take care of business at both ends of the ice.

Ignoring the Czechs may prove to be daft, as they do look like a great team with Jaromir Jagr, Dominik Hasek and Patrik Elias all showing strong form at the moment. However, I will pick them to bow out unexpectedly, for no real reason. I'm not expecting the reigning silver medallists USA to do much beyond the group stage, but it'll be great to see their old guys like Mike Modano and Derian Hatcher in action in whatever hockey I expect to see broadcasted here. Plus they have Scott Gomez. Other teams I expect to progress through the round robin stage: Slovakia (thanks to Marian Gaborik, Marian Hossa and Zdeno Chara) and ze Germans (thanks to Olaf Kolzig and an organised defence).

Most goals: Daniel Alfredsson (Sweden)
Most assists: Jarome Iginla (Canada)
Most points: Joe Thornton (Canada)

Lowest GAA: Martin Brodeur (Canada)
Highest save %: Dominik Hasek (Czech Republic)
Most saves: Italy's goalie. He'll be facing 60 shots a night, so by my calculations, he should be able to save 45 of those.

Most goals scored (team): Canada
Fewest goals conceded (team): Canada

New McLaren F1 livery

McLaren lost their West cigarette sponsorship with the ban being introduced this year. They'd mucked about with an interim orange livery that wasn't much on the eye. This is the one they'll be racing with - and it looks a treat.

2006 McLaren livery (gallery)

I like shiny things.

Aboot Userbars

I saw Brad's blog aboot* userbars and they seem stupid. I knocked one together on Paint (no Photoshop at work) in a few seconds to "support" his cause. Should you wish to join La Revolution, it's the "Visitor" font you can google for.

It reminded me to tell you about the greatest thing a forum reader can have: AdBlock. This Firefox extension lets you right click on any image and simply make it disappear. If any of you frequent forums where users have frightfully annoying (or NSFW - Not Safe For Work) signatures or avatars, it's the ideal way to make it go away.

*I should add that during the Winter Olympics, I'll be replacing about with aboot. Just getting into the spirit, eh!

The third level of metablogging about music reviewers

Saturday, February 11, 2006

Get this: I read Jiggy's post about an online music reviewer's response to another reviewer's criticism of other online music reviewers' failure to use objective evidence to support their views on an album, disputing that feelings aren't enough. Now breathe again...phew. All three have valid, insightful points in them and it's quite an interesting discussion (and topic) for me to contribute to.

To say that technical, compositional, objective evidence is a good judge of music would ignore the feelings and interpretation of the music that the listener has and does. Conversely, subjective feelings aren't enough to create a review. Everyone agrees that reviewers need to explain what it is in the music that makes them respond in certain ways to that music. Reviewers also need both writing skills and analytical skills to form coherent opinions. (No need to criticise my music-related posts either: I'm not a reviewer and I don't pretend to be. I'm an "impression provider" at best.)

I view online music reviews not with a grain of salt, but with a pillar of it. They have been wrong time and time again for me. On occasions I've preferred to take a chance and buy an album rather than sift through a few reviews to identify a trend. I have yet to discover a reviewer that matches my taste consistently. I've taken to downloading one song off an album and making my own judgements accordingly, downloading more if necessary. It's been far more successful and efficient for me.

In general, reviewers are obsessed with comparisons to old records and seem unable to keep the discussion relevant to other listeners. It seems like they describe their own feelings and hope that the album comes across the same way to every other listener, which I simply don't think music possibly can!

It is hard for me to justify my music preferences to anyone with facts. Conversely, how can I know a recommendation will prove valuable? The best hope I have is to compare it with similar bands I already like or find someone with similar taste. Even then it can be in the dark.

I would rather a reviewer identify the little nuances of an album (including aspects of musical composition) as justification, allowing readers to align these observations with the characteristics of music that readers already know they appreciate and look for in an album. That of course assumes that readers know what they want...but it's a start.

The Dawn of Winter...Olympics

Friday, February 10, 2006

For twenty brief minutes, I became palpably excited about the Winter Olympics. Reading the Herald Sun's articles about snowboarding medal hope Torah Bright and Alisa Camplin's struggle to make it to the Games again piqued my interest and alerted me that the action is upon us! With Melbourne's Commonwealth Games beckoning, it appears that the Winter Olympics (or at least the build up) have been neglected altogether.

The 2002 Jeux Olympique d'Hiver were a true spectacle. Riding high off the success of Sydney 2000 and Roy and HG's The Dream, Channel Seven provided complete coverage of all the excitement and Australian success that was to follow. Unlike its Summer counterpart, the Winter Olympics coverage has a balance between watching our Aussie hopes and seeing the best competition on offer. Bobsleigh, ski jumping, speed skating, luge and curling! Oh my!

I'm not so sure this time around. Schedules show that Seven will only show highlights coverage from maybe 9:30pm to 3:30am. Where's the live coverage of these foreign sports throughout the day? More importantly, where's the hockey? Usually we'll get the Gold Medal game (I still have the 2002 one on video, and watched it a few months ago) and several early matches before most sports get started, but those seem to have been left off. Sometimes I feel doomed never to see full hockey games, but to follow the sport vicariously through reports, highlights, stats and speculation. I want my once-every-four-years game to stay!

I remain hopeful of seeing the best on show and enjoying this great competition. Hopefully Channel Seven will do it the justice it deserves. Showing Cool Runnings, one of the greatest films of all-time tonight (with all due respect to Doug E. Doug's other work, such as That Darn Cat!), as a lead-up is a most promising start.

Fantasy Hockey Boasting

Thursday, February 09, 2006

I just remembered one of my favourite things to blog about: my awesomeness at fantasy hockey. Survey says...

Standings (Feb 7)
My Kamikazes Team (Feb 7)

It's mainly thanks to the marvellous goaltending trio of Kiprusoff, Brodeur and Turco. Brodeur was one of the best free agent pick ups ever, just before Elias came back and the Devils picked up their game. Speaking of Elias, his and Marian Gaborik's play after sitting out the start of the season has been terrific. It was well worth keeping them on the bench rather than risk them being snapped up in free agency. Add a little Staal and Heatley and I've got a team that could beat Cannonadia itself.

I would be happy to entertain any trades that get me a defenseman! Anyone want Vinny Lecavalier or Pavel Datsyuk for a genuine D-man who plays special teams and won't be minus-anything?

Cricket Australia and their wacky policies

Australia continues to experiment with their lineup with over a year to go until the Cricket World Cup, claiming a "rotation" policy when they really mean trial and error.

For years the "baggy green" has been coveted. Selectors forced players to earn their inclusion in the Australian squad, toiling in state cricket for years and refusing to change the lineup. We lose one close Ashes series and it's suddenly time to rebuild. I'm all for including youngsters who've earned their chance. I'm not all for picking Fred Nobody and seeing if he's any good. That's what state cricket is for. We need to find players to get us through batting collapses and stand up to pressure, rather than guys who belt pointless fifties when we're miles in front but collapse after a few early wickets (Andrew Symonds). People they tried out a few months ago are already forgotten. Do you know Mitchell Johnson? Remember Shane Tait?

The Australian selectors' willingness to select Brett Dorey, a 28 year old inexperienced fast bowler makes no sense. He's shown us nothing and if he wasn't 203cm he would be incredibly unremarkable in every way. How can you consider experimenting with old unknown quantities? (hehe, I almost said titties...) Go with proven state-level performers. Clark, Bracken and Lewis are all decent selections, as would be South Australia's Mark Cleary. Accuracy is important. Cricket Australia prefers exciting bowlers, but I can't get excited about players who get 1/120 each innings and 4/60 (including three tailenders) each blue moon. Even rejects like Gillespie, Kasprowicz and Bichel have more to offer.

They also can't pick roles suited to the different forms of cricket. Matt Hayden has proven himself as a one-day opener, but had a few bad Test performances during the Ashes and now he can't get in the one-day team. Ridiculous! They've tried Simon Katich as one-day opener for ages without coming to a definitive answer. Here's your answer...NO! And with Damien Martyn's technical batting, he's a Test player not a one-day player.

That clown Andrew Symonds? Save the all-rounders for one-day cricket until they can prove they deserve a Test spot on one discipline alone. Symonds can't even decide if he bowls spin or medium pace! People who can do a bit of everything have nothing to fall back on in the Test arena during a form slump, except the bench if you ask me. I've left a spot for one in my team anyway. I'll pick Shane Watson, who is an actual batter that bowls pace faster and more accurately than Symonds or James Hopes.

I tip my hat to Mike Hussey. The new Bevan. He can save an innings or slap 50 runs off 35 balls if necessary. I feel he's wasted a lot of the time at number 7. He is now an untouchable, alongside Ponting, Gilchrist, Warne and McGrath. Thankfully Australia could kick the arse of any team in the world when they're playing at home, as we'll see in the VB Series finals. It won't be pretty.

My All-Purpose XI: Hayden, Gilchrist, Ponting, Hodge, Hussey, Clarke, Watson, Lee, Warne, Clark, McGrath.

Hockey: Panther Ponderings

Tuesday, February 07, 2006

Ugh. My NHL team, the Florida Panthers, are on track for another below par (or should that be above par considering below par is the goal in golf?) season. They've finished fourth out of five in their division the last three seasons and that's where they're sitting now. They're 7 points adrift of the last playoff berth and sitting 13th of 15 in the Eastern Conference. And it gets worse. Worse than my current overuse of parentheses.

Our two best players, captain Olli Jokinen and All-Star goalie Roberto Luongo are both refusing to sign new long-term contracts until the end of the season. They both know they're playing for a crummy franchise and are holding out for (a form of) free agency or at least a genuine shot at the playoffs next season. Trading them off anything less than All-Stars would infuriate the fans, myself included. This sort of wait-and-see pseudo-blackmail to get our general manager Mike Keenan to sign some star players (or at least a defenseman) frustrates me, but also gives me hope.

Keenan's offered good money contracts to these guys and has virtually been told to sign better players (or we somehow magically make the playoffs). If not, they'll leave for nothing via free agency and the Panthers will be left with very few good players. Keenan has no choice but to be active in the trade market (as we near the trade deadline of March 9) and improve the lineup, so I desperately hope he'll land some signings, boost the team and win Jokinen and Luongo over.

Traditionally, teams out of the playoff race by trade deadline tend to trade off their veterans for draft picks and end up weaker as the playoff bound teams strengthen their chances with proven players. I can only hope we're still in it. After missing four consecutive playoff series, it feels like our lineup gets pillaged annually.

Keenan made some solid veteran signings in the off season (including my old NHL99 favourite Joe Nieuwendyk) but failed to get one of the many genuine stars that were available. With the introduction of the salary cap, I expected the budget/profit-conscious owner to allow the Panthers to be more competitive with their spending. Very little materialised.

And so continues the frustrations of supporting a mediocre team...

Bits And Pieces

Sunday, February 05, 2006

A warm welcome to all of you loyal and semi-loyal readers out there. In case of emergency the exits are here, here, here and here and oxygen is readily available, particularly outside.

I took my first day off since going onto a 2-day-a-week contract at work (in preparation for uni) and I spent it hooning around on golf carts and pretending to be a golfer down at Warburton. I have to say it's the most fun I've had all year, for certain. We did some big 180s, "burnouts" and terrain jumps on the carts, Trav and I "hotwired" Dean and Will's cart and many taunting-related hilarities also occurred. This is what working people miss out on.

I should also add I'm sheleighlying the Sun's ass in our battle for supreme honour. I had 2 pool days during that 40 degree spell and visits to the tennis unscathed and I only had a small part just above my sock line burned at golf. I'll call it 5-1 to me then and with February upon us, that's a nearly unassailable lead.

Shaun Micallef's book Smithereens is fantastic. His writing style would be inspirational if it was conceivable for me to mimic its brilliance, but it is stratospheres above my league.

I've been downloading a bunch of one-off songs to see if there's any albums I should be buying. The Raveonettes' Love In A Trashcan caught my attention. I'm also enjoying The Strokes' First Impressions Of Earth and Kaiser Chiefs' Employment albums.

I can be a TV network programmer

I wasn't so flash yesterday, so I resorted to the flights of fancy provided by television, but more specifically: TV episodes off my laptop.

My own little media centre is up and running with correct Australian spelling to boot and I love it to bits. I don't feel the least bit like a pirate, especially considering that I don't pay for television either.

This is how television should be watched. No flicking until you find something tolerable. No advertisements. Not even getting up to swap the DVD. Just pure instinctive decision making. I feel like some Drawn Together, then some Family Guy and South Park. Episodes. On. Demand. I even intersperse the episodes with a coupla' tunes to have intermissions. The whole thing works like a charm and I ended up enjoying a splendid makeshift evening amongst it all.

The NFL Superbowl and Disrespect

Thursday, February 02, 2006

The NFL's showcase game has again dawned upon us, the world-renowned, roman numeral carrying "Superbowl", in this case Superbowl XL (or 40, not extra large - that joke's been done to death). Under the shadow of an Indianapolis Colts team that started a 16 game season 13-0, then crashed in the playoffs, most teams in the playoffs were crying out for more respect, or at least more TV exposure.

In the black-white-and-yellow corner, the AFC champion Pittsburgh Steelers. Coming from the sixth (and last) seed in the playoffs, they took out the Bengals, Colts and Broncos with big performances from QB Ben Roethlisberger and RB Jerome Bettis. Their explosiveness, plus the fact they went 15-1 last season, has put them three to four point favourites. Unfortunately, they're a gamble. Roethlisberger is only in his second year and performed well below-par last year when breaking new ground in the playoffs. I wonder if the Superbowl nerves could get to him. I should also mention Pittsburgh is the only team in the NFL to have less than two players on their roster with Superbowl experience, and that one guy is a special teams player not worth mentioning. Experience may well be a factor in this big game. Pittsburgh's offense is cunningly coached with several trick plays, but their resources just don't strike as much fear into defenses. However, the Steelers defense, led by the big haired Troy Polamalu is superb and could do some scoring on their own.

In the teal-with-bits-of-green-and-white corner, the NFC champion Seattle Seahawks. With the best NFC record, Seattle cruised through, using their homefield advantage to outplay Washington and outwit the Carolina Panthers. Seattle were dazzling last week, stopping WR Steve Smith and Carolina's offense in their tracks. It's worth noting that Carolina torched the league leading Chicago defense for 434 yards the week before, but Seattle's no-name defense quickly built a name for itself (rookie sensation linebacker Lofa Tatupu is da man) and restricted the Panthers to just over 200 yards. Seattle are more proven on offense, sending at least 6 offensive players to the Pro Bowl (three fifths of the offensive line and the three guys in the backfield). The combination of QB Matt Hasselbeck and NFL MVP Shaun Alexander hasn't looked like being stopped all year, no matter which wide receiver Hasselbeck is turning to, be it Darrell Jackson, Joe Jurevicius or Jerramy Stevens.

Despite their amazing season, Americans agree that Seattle's isolated northwest location, away from the hype of East Coast or Californian teams, has shielded them from media exposure. They barely know the team at all. It's such a common theme that I think it's affected the American bookies, which Australian bookies turn to as a guide. It seems everyone wants to be on the Steelers bandwagon after they slew (that can't be right...) the Indianapolis dragon. Pittsburgh struggled in Roethlisberger's absence during the season and have been crying for respect since finishing the season with 5 straight wins to sneak into the playoffs after his return. They constantly find ways to get a result, but to me, that seems like a risk compared to the more consistent Seattle, who have barely been challenged in recent times.

The Superbowl doesn't normally come to a shootout, normally one team really turns up to play and the other desperately tries to invent a way to get in the contest. For me, I think Seattle will score early, take the lead and use Shaun Alexander The Great in the running game after that. Pittsburgh will try valiantly, but if Seattle can make sure they don't give up the big plays, they should stay in control and win. Given the $2.30 outright win odds on the Seahawks, I can't help but have a punt. I'm tempted to have a go at the margin at $6.75 for Seattle by 7-12 points or a dabble at $14 for 19+ points. An very obscure bet would be a small wager on Matt Hasselbeck to run in the first touchdown of the game: $41 for each $1 that's betted. Just a few ideas to keep my interest going. A few brewskis (not to be confused with Patriots linebacker Teddy Bruschi) might do the job just as well.

Expect a closely fought Superbowl between these two now respected franchises, but not a nailbiter. It rarely seems to turn out that way. I'm backing Seattle 24-13. But I assure you it's not due to a lack of respect for either side.